Another steering question

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67 Tiger

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Ive been thinking about this for a long time. I hope Im able to put my thought into words everyone can understand. Sometimes Im just not smart enough to express myself, in writing, so people understand. As I understand it the major problem with Tiger steering is that the rack centerline is different than the steering arm tie rod connection point. Shelbys recommendation was bend the tie rod. I am a plumber, when I look at the relationship between the rack and tie rod end, I see whats called a "rolling offset". For that to work, as the inner wheel turns, the centerline between the rack and tie rod end increases, thus the distance from the bend in the tie rod to rod end should also increase. Obviously, the solid tie rod cant "grow" as you turn.(I think The Lou Anderson kit addresses this issue, but I could be wrong. ) ALL that being said, what if you just put another bend in the tie rod, bending it back so the tie rod end was parallel with the rack?, making the tie rod look like a lighting bolt.
 
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I have pondered this a bit myself. I think part of the short answer is that the shape of the rod between the pivot points on the rack and the steering arm (i.e., the inner and outer tie rod ends does not affect how they move with respect to each other. All different shapes still will cause those two points to move the same as a straight dotted line between the two pivot points.

I think with the rack so far forward, the original bend was made so the rack could connect to the steering arm at all.

If you look at most steering systems, the rack is positioned to the rear of the vertical axis of where the wheels pivot.The steering arm point to the rear of the vehicle.

The resultant elbow causes the length of that dotted line to change as the steering wheel turns. One side it gets longer and the other side it gets shorter.

This happens regardless of whether the rack is mounted forward or back from the tips of the steering arm. Unfortunately with it forward of the steering arm tips, the effect is reversed on how the wheel moves relative to each other.

This is why you get toe-in as the tiger's wheels are turned. You want toe-out to occur since the inner wheel is on a tighter radius (arc) that the outer one.

Hope your answer is somewhere in all of that.:)

Gene
 
Respectfully, I think that unless the geometry of the pivot points themselves relative to each other is changed, there is no benefit to changing the shape of whatever connects the pivot points.

I currently have the mgb arms and midget rack configuration. As you say, longer steering arms do help a little. Unfortunately, the turning circle also increases, since the rack movement side to side is about the same as the stock unit. Sigh...

Gene
 
It doesn't matter whether the link is a straight line, a lightning bolt, or a curlicue. If the distance between the two pivot points is the same, the shape of the metal between them makes no difference in the motion of the linkage (ignoring stiffness considerations, of course).

What is the Lou Anderson kit?
 
CAT / Lou Anderson ackerman kit

Before my time owning Tigers CAT Member Lou A. designed/engineered the "kit" and for a while it was available through CAT Parts in 70's?

Have you heard of Rube Goldberg?

IIRC when we bought TigerBlue a "kit" was part of the horde of parts we received with the car. No I do not have it. Again IIRC I gave it? sold it? to Dan W. I think he only wanted the steering rack to rebuild?

The kit corrected the ackerman angles by via complex system of connected bell-cranks, levers and pivot points welded to the cross-member. Because my priority was/is high performance driving, Open Track events it seemed risky to me to install it.

I did ante up later for Dale to install the MG steering rack and arms for quicker steering ratio and "improved" not corrected ackerman.

Rick
 
Here's a couple of pics of Lou's kit on a car at TUXXXII... ( click on 'em for a larger pic ) I got interested in it a few years ago and with the help of the original drawing, made my own setup... I mounted the links somewhat differently though.

Lou's original drawings are on my album page... http://catmbr.org/VB_forum/album.php?albumid=14


Jim
B382000446
 
More Anderson info ?

Jim, I know there is more info out there than is contained in your album link.

I have a VERY poor copy of the install instructions that is no longer readable.

The main question I have is: What is the dimension (center to center or short sides of the ID of the balls) of the rod end pairs?

After about 36 years playing with Tigers, I'm finally playing with a car that has the kit, but it has ISSUES.

It would be nice to NOT have to go through the hoops that someone has already done.

And, How many cars are still running an Anderson Kit?
 
spmdr said:
Jim, I know there is more info out there than is contained in your album link.

I have a VERY poor copy of the install instructions that is no longer readable.

The main question I have is: What is the dimension (center to center or short sides of the ID of the balls) of the rod end pairs?

After about 36 years playing with Tigers, I'm finally playing with a car that has the kit, but it has ISSUES.

It would be nice to NOT have to go through the hoops that someone has already done.

And, How many cars are still running an Anderson Kit?
Click to expand...

The setup I made was based on Lou's ideas and worked very well... downside was that about half of the 10 heim joints showed a lot of wear after 5000 miles and I took it off the car. I used very high quality QA1 joints too :(
I've now moved the rotor/caliper/steering arm assembly outboard instead which helps a bit but I'll have to say that Lou's variable length tie rod idea gives you really good ackerman... maybe not so good bump steer though...
I managed to find the install papers that a Tiger owner sent me and just scanned them to my album so you can have a look there... don't see that he shows an actual measurement that your looking for.
We should maybe chat 'off' line as it's a pretty big subject!
 
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