Seeking parts...again.....lol

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Flared1965Tiger

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Hey Y'all!

I have found as I took apart the wing windows that one of the lower die cast sections (shortest side of the triangle) is cracked where the glass fits into the channel (part is marked Left). I am now on the hunt for one as it is die cast and I cannot weld it. I would also like to find:

- A Tiger embossed (understood to be aftermarket) intake manifold.

- A 650CFM(ish) carb.

- An electronic distributor, and or ignition system.

- A Tiger embossed aluminum air cleaner body.

- A set of Jet Coated or stainless headers.


Any help is ALWAYS appreciated, Pete (714)290-2470
 
A Tiger embossed (understood to be aftermarket) intake manifold.


This would be the LAT-3 low rise manifold which was called the LAT-38 on the holomogation papers in 1965. These are extremely rare and the exact number made is close to 45 parts total. These are from the Cobra low rise manifold tooling held by Shelby for the 289 Cobras. They sell very seldom if ever...you would be better off finding a Cobra manifold and paying someone to grind off the Cobra and weld up a TIGER lettering but the Cobra manifolds are rather rare too.....you might spend more than what you paid for your Tiger...

Moondoggie
 
TIGER manifold

There are actually 3 types of TIGER manifold, there is the ford derived one, same as the COBRA intake, there was the blue thunder version and the Edelbrock style.. 2 are low rise one is medium rise. I have pics of all 3 in an old post.. i cant link to them anymore as webshots moved all the stuff. I can look them up at home later and post... or try a search for LAT manifold on the forum and it might come up.

On the TIGER filter housing, there were several repros of those, there as one on ebay about 1.5 months back (maybe not even)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sunbeam-Tig...RciDjI5pZdCpvMTHTbakTHY=&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

$T2eC16J,!yME9s5qF2ZDBQtn7dh0Tw~~60_12.JPG
 
Carb

IMHO unless you are running a full blown race stroker a 650(ish) carb is way to big, especially with such a restrictive intake as the original factory Tiger manifold.

CFM=CID*RPM*VE/3456

Volumetric Efficiency (VE) is around 85-90% for a well tuned street engine. I use a 600 cfm on my 420 hp 331 stroker and it runs like a champ.

My 2 cents

Gary
 
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Peter,

You might want to think about a 600CFM Holley instead of the 650 on your 302.

I have a never used set of CAT headers that have been coated available but if you want stainless CAT should have a batch ready for sale later this month.

You could get a rebuilt Ford Duraspark distributor and a GM HEI module from your Discount auto friends. You'd have a bullet proof ignition for about $40 plus core.

Since you have the SVO aluminum heads you might just give up on a Tiger correct manifold and use a new Edelbrock for a little over a hundred.

good luck

bt
 
Cast Tiger air cleaner

The last that sold for 610 seemed a higher than the others. One was sold on this forum for 400 and another on e bay last year as well for about 400.

Peter is was good to meet you and have new blood at the meeting in Downey Sunday. Wish I had gone for the 10 cent tour of your garage with Buck and Rick and the guys.

Enjoy the car and relish that you get to go custom and are not painted into the corners of stock or period correct.

400 to 600 for a cast air filter housing does not seem like money well spent. We used to sand cast things like that in high school,boy I miss that metal shop. If I had one I'd look to make a few copies.

Seen several F4bs locally for sale but there is probably a newer better design now, I am sure someone will chime in.

Happy to be in the period correct camp, had I not sniped a buy it now stock air cleaner I would be leaning more custom.
 
The edelbrock performer RPM gets a lot of good press, and the low rise fits the tiger (not sure about medium ones) this will also depnd on what filter housing you use.

As for the cast tiger housing.. they are VERY heavy and are not the same size as the factory ones> Prices on them, liek th estock ones fluctaute depnding on how many people want one at a given time.

If you are going period correct they and the manifold are nice parts... but they are costly and somewhat inferior to modern parts in performance.. that said... depends how far you want to go HP wise.. and what look you are after.
 
Great response!!

Gentleman thank you for your responses! I would like to install certain key pieces to the engine bay that cue the "mommy look! A tiger!" response but about the restrictive intake manifold I must agree that it would be wasteful of the SVO 302 I got with the car to use an antiquated manifold designed for a lower CFM rate. I did some research yesterday on the latest manifolds and Carbs from Elelbrock and the do sell nice matched sets that will feed this 302 for around $650.00. I will have to be satisfied with the finned Tiger aluminum air cleaner body and valve covers as well as the Tiger fill tank to give that engine bay the right "feel". The suggestion for the self contained HEI is probably also a good one as it does not add as much clutter (or cost) as an MSD setup. If Y'all spot anything I am still looking for please throw a rock!!

Peter
 
My recomendation for an ignition/distributor system is to buy a dual point distributor from a Ford K code 65-66 motor and install the Crane pointless ingnition module. It will cost you about $400 give or take but it will look period correct and it works every time unlike MSD & Pertronics crapola.

Moondoggie
 
Crane pointless ignition module

Moondoggie said:
My recomendation for an ignition/distributor system is to buy a dual point distributor from a Ford K code 65-66 motor and install the Crane pointless ingnition module. It will cost you about $400 give or take but it will look period correct and it works every time unlike MSD & Pertronics crapola.

Moondoggie
Click to expand...

Moondoggie I googled install a pointless ignition - Kit Car Builder, and went to a site that showed the step by step installation on a ford distributor. Summit sells these kits for $80 are these the ones your talking about. I know there are others on the market as well. kbeck
 
RE: Distributer idea from Moondoggie

Yeah, that is a good call, an older (1964-1964) style, of the correct brand and design would look most appropriate in the engine bay. I did see conversion kits on Jegs, and Summit last night. The GM "style" one wire, internal coil is distributer is a nice "all in one" but perhaps not really age appropriate.

Peter
 
Although a lot of Tiger owners have reported good experiences with the Pertronix products, I never had good luck with either the Pertronix I or II. (And I know Pertronix ignitions require coils with the specific resistances.) (I also know that if a product has problems, a company like Pertronix will move quickly to fix it and my problems were years ago with the I & II.)

However I can report I have extensively tested the Pertronix III on race tracks with absolutely no problems. It gets my thumbs up. It revs to 8K just fine, has a built in adjustable rev limiter and seems very rugged. And it's a multi-spark throughout the entire RPM range.

As far as the distributor itself, For street use I prefer to use a unit with a vacuum advance. I'd suggest staying away from a distributor that only has mechanical advance. (With mechanical only you end up with less advance at cruise which really hurts the gas mileage.) Besides, if you want the motor to look stock you'd probably want the vacuum advance canister anyway.

In an earlier post I mentioned using a Ford DuraSpark distributor. These look like the stock Tiger distributor when equipped with a small cap. They have a vacuum advance. When I use a GM HEI with it, I located the HEI module outside the cap.

bt
 
(With mechanical only you end up with less advance at cruise which really hurts the gas mileage.)

Buck.....You set up a mechanical distributor to give you full 32 degrees advance at 1600 to 1800 rpm that vacum job is lucky to get there if ever by 3000 rpm. But to even the playing field the person building the car needs to determine if gas mileage is important over horse power. I'm a horse power guy
and my experiance with MSD & Pertronics products in motors making more than 600 HP is crapola. THe Pertronics III unit requires a 9 volt battery to adjust the rev limiter and it does not adjust between 500 rpm ranges. The one I have just barely does 1000 rpm increments. The Crane is like light years
ahead of it's time. It must be just me but I would never want a bone stock 260 lurking in a Tiger that I owned...boring....slow.....The Tiger can perform
much better than a Cobra..I think John Morten has proven that many times over the years....

Moondoggie
 
Actually the Pertronix III limiter can be adjusted to any multiple of 100 RPM.
i.e. 6000 or 6100 or 6200 or 6300... you get the picture. I've done it many times. If someone needs help with this, please contact me offline.

As far as mileage and advance at low throttle...
an earlier post ignored the performance benefit of vacuum advance. I'll try to explain it but Tiger owner Jerry Christopherson sells a great DVD that devotes over an hour to it and other Tiger distributor curving issues. I found it well worth the modest price he charges.

With a distributor that has only mechanical advance you set your total advance to whatever number you pick. The curve you build into it with the weights and springs gives a specific advance for each specific RPM. Usual performance curving for a 260 or 289 will have advance full in at 2600 RPM. With a mechanical only distributor you simply set the total to whatever number you want and everything else is then fixed. This setting is usually made conservatively to avoid detonation at wide open throttle.

That's fine for a race car that usually operates at WOT. However, it ignores the fact that engines at partial load run better with more advance than at WOT. Over 99% of street driving is done at partial load. On the street you end up with a curve that is correct about 1% of the time.

Gaining the needed extra advance is why Vacuum advance was invented. The vacuum advance mechanism simply adds more advance at partial loads. Tom Hall uses vacuum advance to get something like 45 degrees total on Tigers at partial load cruise. You'd detonate and maybe destroy your engine trying to do that with a distributor that only had mechanical advance.

Virtually all distributor equipped cars came from the factory with vacuum advance in addition to the mechanical. Modern cars take this even further. If you have instrumentation (like a Scan Gauge) that allows you to monitor you car's ECU, you may observe advance numbers higher than 50 degrees at partial throttle cruise.

bt
 
Here is what I know about distributors.

I am very happy with my MSD billet ready to run distro. It is electronic and has and adjustable rev limiter. It also has 24 mechanical advance curves that can be set with a combination of springs and total stop bushings (18,21,25,28). It also has a vacuum advance that can be locked out if needed.

I run 13 degrees static, 21 degrees mechanical for a total of 34 degrees mechanical. So under WOT throttle conditions, I will have 34 degrees advance. The "pot" has 15 degrees more I believe (need to check), so while partial throttle cruising at 75 mph, I am pulling 49 degrees of timing for economy. Anytime I get into the throttle and the vacuum signal decreases, so does the vacuum advance.

I have had no issues of detonation with this set up using 91 octane fuel with a 10.8:1 CR engine.
 
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Duke Mk1a said:
I run 13 degrees static, 21 degrees mechanical for a total of 34 degrees mechanical. So under WOT throttle conditions, I will have 34 degrees advance. The "pot" has 15 degrees more I believe (need to check), so while partial throttle cruising at 75 mph, I am pulling 49 degrees of timing for economy. Anytime I get into the throttle and the vacuum signal decreases, so does the vacuum advance.

I have had no issues of detonation with this set up using 91 octane fuel with a 10.8:1 CR engine.
Click to expand...

Duke.....

Running these high advances on a modern computer controled engine is just fine since they have knock sensors located on the engine to mamnage detonation. In our case we do not have this feature so the risk is detonation that you probaly won't hear leading to excessive heat and engine damage. On a non computer controlled performance engine I would never run more than 34 degrees total advance to be on the safe side. If you want economy then look to better gearing...

Moondoggie
 
Moondoggie said:
On a non computer controlled performance engine I would never run more than 34 degrees total advance to be on the safe side. If you want economy then look to better gearing...
Click to expand...

I frequent this forum a lot for info on my high power 347 - http://forums.corral.net/forums/5-0-5-8-engine-tech/

A lot of fuel injection and a lot of carb engine experince there. What I am running on my 347 is very common with the carb guys and I am actually several degrees of advance conservative that most of them. I also have a real time WB O2 reading that I can monitor. No fear of detonation here. Is detonation even possible at ~8% (if even that) throttle while cruising.

Will be curing the gearing like you.......man will my MPG improve with my vacuum advanced distro.
 
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